Tuned Trackhawks should have their oil analyzed - Jeep TrackHawk Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 04-15-2019, 12:03 AM Thread Starter
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Tuned Trackhawks should have their oil analyzed

I am curious if any of you who have had their engines tuned to produce upwards of 900 horsepower (or more) had their oil tested for fuel contamination or excessive wear?
I recently had one of my tuned vehicles in for an engine code that indicated a possible stretched timing chain at 88K ( normally about $2,500- $3,000). I am diligent as to regular servicing of the vehicle and generally filled it with Amsoil, with one or two Mobil one changes over the vehicle’s life.
Thinking that a stretched timing chain can be a result of greatly increased boost pressure, I went through the process of an inspection at a trusted garage. The valve train was squeaky clean and the chain was stretched somewhat, but, it was also evident that the overhead cam lobes were severely worn, as well as evidence of possible accelerated valve guide wear ( it was not burning oil between changes).
I contacted Amsoil and spoke to the representative who sent me an oil analysis kit which I sent to a lab. The lab test indicated that the oil was diluted with fuel.
Btw, my vehicle ran just fine both before and after the engine inspection and really had the techs scratching their heads ( they originally thought the sensors were faulty).

My concern is that the tuning maps may be programmed to deliver a healthy dose of fuel to maintain an additional margin of safety during boost conditions.

My question is specifically directed to the owners on the forum who have had heavy mods and corresponding tunes done to their engines. I would strongly suggest that they purchase oil analysis kits ( around $30) to check for fuel contamination or excessive metal in their used motor oil to avoid greatly accelerated engine wear.
I would also suggest halving their oil change intervals as well.

I would like to see other’s test results posted to see the wear and tear on our engines as owners rack up the miles.
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post #2 of 12 Old 04-15-2019, 12:22 AM
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+1 on oil analysis.

I recently had a similar "fuel in oil" discovery on one of my vintage cars when I sent it in for analysis.

I had the car on a racetrack, and it was running strong, with absolutely no indication of a problem, except for a suddenly-dropped oil pressure. It went from 70 psi to no more than 20 psi.

There was no overheating of oil or coolant, no smoke out of exhaust, no detonation, no stumbling, no oil smell or fuel smell.

Once back in the paddock, I opened the hood and the engine was cool enough to put my hand on the valve covers. Definitely hadn't overheated. The oil on the dipstick was clear and smelled clean. The oil level was near full. There was no fluid leaking or dripping anywhere. Radiator was full.

Had to be an oil pump, we figured. Or an oil pressure gauge/sending unit.
I put the car on my trailer and took it home.

Back at the shop, the oil gauge/sender checked out good. I decided on an oil analysis before doing anything else.

The analysis revealed fuel in the oil. As well as lead (from the 110 octane leaded race gas I was running at the track.) And some iron.

I had busted a piston ring, and blown part of the intake manifold gasket. But, the baffling part is how normally and smoothly the engine had continued to run. I've damaged/blown-up other engines in my day, and I know what that feels like. This didn't feel like that.

Lesson learned, and noted. If we'd merely replaced the oil pump, as everyone thought the culprit was, and not done an oil analysis, we wouldn't have suspected the ring. Like I said, there was zero smoke or any other of the usual suspects.

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post #3 of 12 Old 04-15-2019, 08:48 AM
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2-3k mile intervals should be the norm. If you are running E85, its even more critical


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post #4 of 12 Old 04-15-2019, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by ThawkMike View Post
2-3k mile intervals should be the norm. If you are running E85, its even more critical


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yes agreed they even make special oil for people that run E85. my builder suggested it. I have the name in a email somewhere but forget off hand. I get first oil change for free so I will use that when its time then I am going to swap to the oil he suggested.
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post #5 of 12 Old 04-16-2019, 01:46 AM
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Be interesting to chat with Blackstone Labs to see how many samples they have in their "stock motor" group now for comparison. They've been among the highest volume labs and having a solid read on "what's normal" helps a lot particularly with wear metals. They'll also give you solid recommendations on change intervals

Cam lobe and guide wear can also be a sign of too much valve spring. The cam manufacturer should recommend (or ideally provide) a spring suitable for the application. A fair number of builders will take what they think is a "conservative approach" so they can spin the motor an extra 1000-1500 RPM by on packing in a set of super-stiff Ferrea (or Ferrea doubles) that are way too much for the rest of the valvetrain and turn cam gears, cams, etc. into consumables. Not knocking Ferrea in any way, great springs, just have to get the right ones for the rest of the supporting drivetrain.
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post #6 of 12 Old 04-16-2019, 08:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROCKETW19 View Post
yes agreed they even make special oil for people that run E85. my builder suggested it. I have the name in a email somewhere but forget off hand. I get first oil change for free so I will use that when its time then I am going to swap to the oil he suggested.
What kind of oil is that? I am switching to e85 in the next couple weeks!
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post #7 of 12 Old 04-16-2019, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROCKETW19 View Post
yes agreed they even make special oil for people that run E85. my builder suggested it. I have the name in a email somewhere but forget off hand. I get first oil change for free so I will use that when its time then I am going to swap to the oil he suggested.
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Originally Posted by JohnWGW View Post
What kind of oil is that? I am switching to e85 in the next couple weeks!

Interested in getting an answer on this as well and what should be my interval. 2K miles seems really especially low when the manuals says not to exceed 6K.
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post #8 of 12 Old 04-16-2019, 12:06 PM
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It didnt say to change every 2K Miles. this oil had something to do with water and pistons. I will get the exact name from him today for sure.
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post #9 of 12 Old 04-16-2019, 12:35 PM
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Ill try my best to relate the info over. Its not a special oil its a cleaner. I was confused by the name "Marvel Mystery oil" he said use that as water get on top of the pistons. this stuff will clean it off. I have never used it so no clue just what he told me.

He also said to change the oil every 2500 miles. the E85 gets in the oil and brakes it down faster. No clue on that either

I will look into the Marvel Oil stuff to see if I will use (not sure on that one yet) but I will def listen to him on changing the oil every 2500 miles. I normally use Mobil 1 but not if I am going to change it so soon ill use reg oil now.
Hopefully someone has more info on either of these subjects?
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post #10 of 12 Old 04-16-2019, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ROCKETW19 View Post
Ill try my best to relate the info over. Its not a special oil its a cleaner. I was confused by the name "Marvel Mystery oil" he said use that as water get on top of the pistons. this stuff will clean it off. I have never used it so no clue just what he told me.

He also said to change the oil every 2500 miles. the E85 gets in the oil and brakes it down faster. No clue on that either

I will look into the Marvel Oil stuff to see if I will use (not sure on that one yet) but I will def listen to him on changing the oil every 2500 miles. I normally use Mobil 1 but not if I am going to change it so soon ill use reg oil now.
Hopefully someone has more info on either of these subjects?
Sounds like Seafoam - which I was always told to stay away from putting this stuff along with octane boosters in our engines. Would love to hear from those that do.
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