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We are now in the newly developed stages of Livernois Motorsport cold air intake.

This cold air intake is massive 5 inch elbow transitioning up to a 6 inch air filter. That will be boxed in for a true cold air kit not just a high flow filter on a stick pulling in all the hot air from under the hood. We can also get this powder coated to about any color of you liking.

Here are a few photo's enjoy and if you have any questions do not hesitate to ask.

The completed kit is on our shop Hellcat so you guys can get an idea on what the finished product will look like.

Sincerely
Scott Mitchell @ Livernois Motorsports
 

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I took out my stock airbox/ filter assembly to see what it looked like underneath and boy was I disappointed with what I saw. I thought there was going to be some nice duct work leading from the driver side fog light opening to the bottom of the airbox, and no there isn’t. Sorry I didn’t snap a photo while I had it apart. There is a bottom plastic bracket the airbox sits on that has maybe a 3” x 4” opening in it. At this point, I would say anything is going to be an improvement over the stock airbox as long as it can shield the engine heat away.

Scott,
Your intake looks promising. Do you think you will try to direct more cooling air in from the fog light opening on the Track Hawks?

Thanks!
 

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Looks really nice. As Overkill said... anything will be better than stock. Scott... will this require some additional tuning? I can see how it would.
 
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Discussion Starter #5
I took out my stock airbox/ filter assembly to see what it looked like underneath and boy was I disappointed with what I saw. I thought there was going to be some nice duct work leading from the driver side fog light opening to the bottom of the airbox, and no there isn’t. Sorry I didn’t snap a photo while I had it apart. There is a bottom plastic bracket the airbox sits on that has maybe a 3” x 4” opening in it. At this point, I would say anything is going to be an improvement over the stock airbox as long as it can shield the engine heat away.

Scott,
Your intake looks promising. Do you think you will try to direct more cooling air in from the fog light opening on the Track Hawks?

Thanks!
Afternoon sir.

Thank you for the kind words on our new developmental product. We will not be bring in any cool air from up front through the fog light openings but when you remove the bottom tray it opens up a good amount of spots were you can get air into that cavity.
 

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Bringing the CAI all the way down to the fog lights is a recipe for disaster I’d think. That is asking for trouble driving through puddles, you would eventually suck up some water and detonate your engine. I had a CAI on my 2010 GC SRT8 that sucked up water as I drove through a puddle and made my engine toast, and that CAI wasn’t nearly as low as this would be if it were piped all the way down to the fog lights. Maybe that’s why FCA didn’t do this, they don’t want to be replacing dozens of engines under warranty. Which is probably also why none of the aftermarket shops have piped it all the way down there, they don’t want the liability either.
 

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+1 on JMS935's post.

Livernois: Any plans to offer the top cover in a good ol' FCA black plastic style? The reason I ask is that I live in CA and I don't think your metal cover over the filter element will pass the visual emissions equipment inspection. But, with a nondescript plastic cover, maybe it could sneak by...???
 

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I am curious if that top plate acts as an air block to force the vehicular frontal ram air into/towards the filter housing. Is the plenum tubing made out of aluminum? It appears somewhat similar to Legmakers setup, conceptually speaking, but, he does feel that a CF plenum ( aesthetics aside) transfers less ambient heat to the air charge than a metal plenum. Are there any measured (HP/ torque) numbers that you are ready to publish yet?
BTW, I have purchased a cold air setup from you for another one of my vehicles and was quite pleased with it, so I expect this example to have an exceptional fit and function as well.
 

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Afternoon sir.

Thank you for the kind words on our new developmental product. We will not be bring in any cool air from up front through the fog light openings but when you remove the bottom tray it opens up a good amount of spots were you can get air into that cavity.
Thank you. I agree, I don’t see how that bottom tray is helping anything in relation to performance other than something for the airbox to sit on. ;)
 

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Bringing the CAI all the way down to the fog lights is a recipe for disaster I’d think. That is asking for trouble driving through puddles, you would eventually suck up some water and detonate your engine. I had a CAI on my 2010 GC SRT8 that sucked up water as I drove through a puddle and made my engine toast, and that CAI wasn’t nearly as low as this would be if it were piped all the way down to the fog lights. Maybe that’s why FCA didn’t do this, they don’t want to be replacing dozens of engines under warranty. Which is probably also why none of the aftermarket shops have piped it all the way down there, they don’t want the liability either.
I agree. I wasn’t asking about a ram air snorkel that can suck up water, just something that finishes what FCA “said” they were doing by removing the fog lights to channel more air in for the SC intake. If you haven’t done so already, take the airbox out and you will see exactly what I mean. Even if someone made a side shield that went a little lower in the engine bay it would indirectly channel more of the cool air from outside of the engine bay while shielding away the engine heat. If you don’t plan to purchase a CAI right away, I suggest you don’t remove your stock filter or airbox to take a peek…. I did, and now I am shopping around for an aftermarket CAI. LOL… At this point, anything is going to be an improvement over the stock setup. Maybe they did this on purpose to drive up sales for Mopar aftermarket sales…?
 

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I’ll wait until more reviews are in on CAI’s before I buy one, so I won’t be removing anything at your recommendation. I hear ya on the marketing of it, that’s kind of strange that we lost the fog lights for nothing more than false advertising. Maybe they planned to pipe it all the way down there and realized what a bad idea that would be, and never really properly resolved the issue after that. That’s kinda what it sounds like based on what we’re hearing from you and others exploring down there.
 
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Discussion Starter #13
+1 on JMS935's post.

Livernois: Any plans to offer the top cover in a good ol' FCA black plastic style? The reason I ask is that I live in CA and I don't think your metal cover over the filter element will pass the visual emissions equipment inspection. But, with a nondescript plastic cover, maybe it could sneak by...???
Eventually we will create a plastic molded CAI still looking to work with a manufacturer for that. For now this is the fastest way to create a cold air kit for us we can cut these and have a fairly quick turn around once we get rolling. Still in the very early stages of this and already we have made a fair amount of changes.
 
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Discussion Starter #14
I am curious if that top plate acts as an air block to force the vehicular frontal ram air into/towards the filter housing. Is the plenum tubing made out of aluminum? It appears somewhat similar to Legmakers setup, conceptually speaking, but, he does feel that a CF plenum ( aesthetics aside) transfers less ambient heat to the air charge than a metal plenum. Are there any measured (HP/ torque) numbers that you are ready to publish yet?
BTW, I have purchased a cold air setup from you for another one of my vehicles and was quite pleased with it, so I expect this example to have an exceptional fit and function as well.

As of now this whole set up is made of aluminum and yes we agree the aluminum tubing will transfer less ambient heat and also dissipate heat when the vehicle sits and cools down.We have not got this 1000% to our liking yet so we have not done any dyno pulls with it but as we move forward I am sure we will be doing some dyno testing in the very near future. Yes we do use the frontal ram air for the inlet.

Thank you for your past business and kind words on your past product that you bought from us. That is one thing we pride ourselves on is making sure our product fits perfect and does exactly what we say it does.
 

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Good concepts.
Here is what I would like to see: 1)
Provide a replacement windshield washer fluid tank ( cut the bottom of that huge windshield washer fluid tank off) 2) now we have some room down there, open that space up behind the air intake, a lot, 3) create a funnel for ALL of that intake air up to the air filter, 4) heat shields for the funnel area etc, 5) make it really easy to swap back the old stock setup as needed. With this, you will have an awesome unbeatable winner! I will be first in line. Keep up the great work!! Cheers!
 
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Discussion Starter #16
Good concepts.
Here is what I would like to see: 1)
Provide a replacement windshield washer fluid tank ( cut the bottom of that huge windshield washer fluid tank off) 2) now we have some room down there, open that space up behind the air intake, a lot, 3) create a funnel for ALL of that intake air up to the air filter, 4) heat shields for the funnel area etc, 5) make it really easy to swap back the old stock setup as needed. With this, you will have an awesome unbeatable winner! I will be first in line. Keep up the great work!! Cheers!
I will share this with my product development department.

Thank you for the input this would be a really great concept.
 

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Regarding black carbon fiber Vs. Aluminum heat transfer: I do a lot of work in this area. I can assure you anything black is the highest heat radiator — REALLY high! And aluminum has a very low heat radiation factor. Anything white has the lowest (best). Heat absorption and radiation rates go hand in hand. Best might be white anodized aluminum. No paint please - nothing that can flake off. Other components: silicone rubber is very superior to EPDM. Silicone will take more than double the temps, and double the elasticity. And you can get it in white if you like....
More info:
http://www.bestmaterials.com/masterflash_sizes_and_materials.aspx#PIPE_FLASHING_BOOT_MATERIALS_PROPERTIES
We have pipe boots in all sizes and some colors. Let me know if you need something to play with....
 

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Regarding black carbon fiber Vs. Aluminum heat transfer: I do a lot of work in this area. I can assure you anything black is the highest heat radiator — REALLY high! And aluminum has a very low heat radiation factor. Anything white has the lowest (best). Heat absorption and radiation rates go hand in hand. Best might be white anodized aluminum. No paint please - nothing that can flake off. Other components: silicone rubber is very superior to EPDM. Silicone will take more than double the temps, and double the elasticity. And you can get it in white if you like....
More info:
http://www.bestmaterials.com/masterflash_sizes_and_materials.aspx#PIPE_FLASHING_BOOT_MATERIALS_PROPERTIES
We have pipe boots in all sizes and some colors. Let me know if you need something to play with....
Are you talking in relation to heat retention on the CAI? Cause if so, color of it shouldn’t matter since it’s not in direct exposure to sunlight. Color alone shouldn’t affect heat absorption when it’s not in direct contact with sunlight. So a black carbon fiber intake shouldn’t be any hotter than a white one. The only factor (I’d think) in heat retention for a cold air intake, is the material itself regardless of its color.
 

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Are you talking in relation to heat retention on the CAI? Cause if so, color of it shouldn’t matter since it’s not in direct exposure to sunlight. <snip>.
+1, color alone, in the absence of a direct light source, is not a factor in heat retention or radiation (color is just how we "see" how much light is being reflected vs being absorbed (which becomes heat))

When discussed in other forums the consensus has been that focusing on insulating the tube doesn't produce any measureable gains in power. Grossly oversimplified math just to illustrate
* ignoring throttle restrictions, supercharger, etc., 6.2l @ 4,000RPM would be moving around 875 CFM.
* in a 6" round diameter pipe that air is moving at 18 ft/s, time in tube would be < 0.5 seconds
* air is an excellent insulator, and with very little surface area within the tube an insignificant amount of heat transfer would occur over a 0.5s exposure
 

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Most of the heat under hood is radiated heat. A black surface will absorb more of this, while an aluminum or white will absorb less. And a black material will radiate (emitt) its absorbed heat similarly (roughly 5 to 8 times difference). The other two forms of heat transfer are convection and conduction — little of this happens in the air intake system (almost zero).
I completely agree that in our applications, little of this should matter. All academic. The only point being is if your going for the best, aluminum components will be superior.
In the case of our Trackhawks, we see the air intake temps rise quickly at an idle or while staging. The rise is a lot — like 15+ degrees. This heat rise while staging for drag racing is one reason for the focus of this subject, and why we are so interested in the cold air intake source and it’s design.
All great discussion! Cheers!
 
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